Never tell your password to anyone.
Sunday, December 29, 2013
5:57 PM - Comr4de: man fuck you
5:57 PM - Tailgate: what
5:57 PM - Comr4de: oh wait u replied
5:57 PM - Comr4de: sry
5:57 PM - Comr4de: i thot u were ignorin me
5:58 PM - Tailgate: yeah fuck face
5:58 PM - Comr4de: :(
5:58 PM - Comr4de: wait what
5:58 PM - Comr4de: why were you ignoring me
5:58 PM - Tailgate: i wasnt ignoring you
5:58 PM - Comr4de: o
5:59 PM - Comr4de: EW is funs
5:59 PM - Comr4de: kinetic strike module is hilariou
5:59 PM - Comr4de: s
Monday, December 30, 2013
12:36 AM - Tailgate: comro ur in the navy help me schol this bithc


12:32 AM - RMS Gigantic: I'm not a fan of how modern ships have half-inch-thick aluminum armor and weaponry that would 

lose against a battleship if they encountered one
12:32 AM - Tailgate: the terms of engagement have changed
12:32 AM - RMS Gigantic: Warships, I mean
12:32 AM - Tailgate: shits all done with missiles now
12:32 AM - RMS Gigantic: That's the thing
12:33 AM - Tailgate: the heavily armored battleship would probably blow the modern tin cans out of the water if it got close
12:33 AM - RMS Gigantic: An Iowa-class battleship would BOUNCE a modern anti-ship missile, if I understand how modern 

anti-ship missiles work correctly
12:33 AM - Tailgate: but it wouldnt get close
12:33 AM - RMS Gigantic: Oh, it could
12:33 AM - RMS Gigantic: Our battleships are currently kept near heavily populated cities
12:33 AM - RMS Gigantic: Like Los Angeles, or in Pearl Harbor
12:34 AM - Tailgate: planes would kill it, missiles would kill it, subs would kill it, and all from farther away than the battleship 

would be able to strike back
12:34 AM - RMS Gigantic: I just said missiles would not kill it
12:34 AM - Tailgate: the age of the battleship is over, they're museums now
12:34 AM - Tailgate: and what a great source you provided to back that up
12:34 AM - RMS Gigantic: Modern anti-ship missiles rely on puncturing maybe 1 inch of aluminum armor, and then exploding 

behind it
12:34 AM - RMS Gigantic: The Iowa class has 12 inches of ballistic armor
12:34 AM - RMS Gigantic: Modern anti-ship missiles would most likely bounce off
12:35 AM - Tailgate: i dont think a missile is capable of "bouncing", its just going to punch through 1 of the 12 inches and then 

explode, taking the other 11 with it
12:35 AM - RMS Gigantic: That's not how armor works


12:37 AM - Comr4de: what the FUCK is this chucklefuck saying
12:37 AM - Comr4de: get that dipshit in here
12:37 AM - Comr4de: wait
12:37 AM - Comr4de: let me finish reading
12:37 AM - Comr4de: GET HIM IN HERE
Monday, December 30, 2013
12:37 AM - Your chat with Comr4de is now a multi-user chat.
12:37 AM - Comr4de has been invited to chat.
12:37 AM - RMS Gigantic has been invited to chat.
12:37 AM - RMS Gigantic entered chat.
12:37 AM - Comr4de: im getting harm too
12:37 AM - RMS Gigantic: Ohi
12:37 AM - Comr4de: this is going to be fun
12:37 AM - Tailgate: i have a friend who knows more shit about this than i do
12:38 AM - RMS Gigantic: Roger that
12:38 AM - Tailgate: hed be more than happy to explain
12:38 AM - RMS Gigantic: Comr4de, how do modern anti-ship missiles work?
12:38 AM - Comr4de: alright DIPSHIT
12:38 AM - RMS Gigantic: My sources are sketchy
12:38 AM - Comr4de: have you ever heard of the munroe effect
12:39 AM - Comr4de: it uses superheated plasma formed from the deformation of a copper plate due to high explosive power
12:39 AM - Comr4de: this superheated plasma then removes whatever the fuck you put in front of it
12:39 AM - Comr4de: including up to one foot of solid steel
12:39 AM - RMS Gigantic: Ah; I'm used to shell mechanics pre-shaped charges
12:39 AM - Comr4de: yeah no
12:39 AM - Comr4de: missiles dont explode on contact
12:39 AM - Comr4de: this isn't fucking looney tunes
12:39 AM - RMS Gigantic: I know that
12:39 AM - Harm entered chat.
12:39 AM - Comr4de: HARM
12:39 AM - RMS Gigantic: They are designed to explode behind the armor, are they not?
12:39 AM - Comr4de: no
12:40 AM - Comr4de: no they are not
12:40 AM - Comr4de: all they really need to fucking do is make a hole in the side of the boat
12:40 AM - Comr4de: preferably below the waterline
12:40 AM - Harm: big ships, they make defeaning booms :(
12:40 AM - RMS Gigantic: Alright, well then put it in terms of nuclear weaponry if possible
12:40 AM - Comr4de: because after that, they do this crazy thing called sinking
12:40 AM - RMS Gigantic: I'm more knowledgeable on that
12:40 AM - Comr4de: dude what
12:40 AM - Comr4de: nuclear weaponry obviates all warfare
12:40 AM - Comr4de: period
12:40 AM - RMS Gigantic: I mean in terms of triggering mechanisms
12:40 AM - Comr4de: uhhhhh
12:40 AM - RMS Gigantic: Altimeters, not contact, etc.
12:40 AM - Comr4de: hm
12:41 AM - Harm: I hear anti ship missiles bounce off battleships
12:41 AM - Comr4de: giggling irl
12:41 AM - RMS Gigantic: Or, for really early, counters
12:41 AM - RMS Gigantic: Er, timers
12:41 AM - Harm: although the most vunerable part of a battleship
12:41 AM - Harm: is the deck
12:41 AM - RMS Gigantic: Indeed
12:41 AM - Harm: i'm not a navy expert
12:41 AM - Comr4de: missiles do not cruise at sea height
12:41 AM - RMS Gigantic: Then there's an invulnrebility zone, at least which existed in the era of the battleship
12:42 AM - Harm: my knowledge is in ground equipment
12:42 AM - Comr4de: ok nvm harm get out of here
12:42 AM - Harm: okay :(
12:42 AM - Comr4de: I'll meet you in ALB in a second
12:42 AM - RMS Gigantic: My knowledge is mostly WWII or earlier
12:42 AM - Comr4de: <3 u
12:42 AM - Comr4de: yeah ok
12:42 AM - RMS Gigantic: I said a while back that my sources are sketchy
12:42 AM - Comr4de: here's the deal
12:42 AM - Harm: i wish discuss naval history
12:42 AM - Harm: like monitor ship
12:42 AM - RMS Gigantic: So please fill me in, preferrably without the sass.
12:42 AM - Comr4de: old battleships were designed to engage line of sight targets
12:42 AM - Comr4de: IE shit they could see
12:42 AM - RMS Gigantic: Not true
12:42 AM - RMS Gigantic: They also had spotter planes
12:43 AM - Comr4de: yes
12:43 AM - Comr4de: but even then they were limited by the range of the big guns
12:43 AM - RMS Gigantic: For shit that was over the horizon and out of their line of sight
12:43 AM - Harm: they could fire over the horizon
12:43 AM - RMS Gigantic: Yup, out to 20 miles or so
12:43 AM - Harm: those steam dreadnaughts didn't have spotter planes
12:43 AM - RMS Gigantic: But the WWII-era ones did
12:43 AM - Comr4de: alright
12:43 AM - Comr4de: 20 miles
12:43 AM - RMS Gigantic: 25 for the Yamato
12:43 AM - RMS Gigantic: In fact, I think the Yamato could reach 26
12:44 AM - Tailgate: his point is that missiles are so much longer range than guns that you need sophisticated techno magic to 

spot shit for it instead of binoculars and a radio
12:44 AM - RMS Gigantic: But Iowa was 16 miles for shore bombardment and 20 miles to sea
12:44 AM - Comr4de: let's take a look at the modern french (meaning cheap and reliable) exocet
12:44 AM - Comr4de: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exocet
12:44 AM - Comr4de: This is one of the few ship-to-ship missiles that's ever seen combat use
12:44 AM - Comr4de: it's range is 70 miles
12:44 AM - Comr4de: that's 45 more than 25
12:44 AM - Comr4de: 44 more than 26
12:44 AM - Comr4de: and that's an old fucker
12:45 AM - RMS Gigantic: But what was it used ON?
12:45 AM - Tailgate: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ea/Exocet_imapct.jpg
wo
12:45 AM - RMS Gigantic: And, more importantly, how does it work?
12:45 AM - Comr4de: a brit destroyer, which is irrelevant
12:45 AM - Harm: the problem with modern naval warfare is that it's all based on speculation and that we don't have anything 

to compare it to
12:45 AM - Comr4de: remember the munroe effect i mentioned?
12:45 AM - Harm: kind of like how no one saw tank warfare in ww2
12:45 AM - Comr4de: ww1*
12:46 AM - Harm: like the tank was to support infantry, not be thrown into an individual regiment
12:46 AM - Comr4de: it uses that superheated plasma to pierce the hull and then light shit on fire
12:46 AM - RMS Gigantic: Indeed, though I don't think I wholly understand it
12:46 AM - Comr4de: also makes stuff explode
12:46 AM - Comr4de: hm
12:46 AM - RMS Gigantic: It seems like it works a bit like HEAT shells
12:46 AM - Comr4de: yeah
12:46 AM - Comr4de: except there is an explosive element that does detonate however this detonation takes place after the hole 

int he armor has been made
12:46 AM - Comr4de: alright alright
12:46 AM - RMS Gigantic: So how is the hole made to begin with?
12:46 AM - Comr4de: let's try this one out for size
12:47 AM - RMS Gigantic: And, hypothetically, what happens if a hole fails to be made?
12:47 AM - Comr4de: ...the detonation of the HEAT shell
12:47 AM - Comr4de: it's a tandem warhead
12:47 AM - Comr4de: uhhh there's still a big fuckin explosion
12:47 AM - Comr4de: I'm sure it's going to at least knock out the shot glass collection of the skipper
12:47 AM - Comr4de: ok sorry that was a little sassy
12:47 AM - RMS Gigantic: What happens if the armor isn't of the reactive variety?
12:47 AM - RMS Gigantic: I know what reactive armor is, for the record
12:48 AM - Comr4de: theeeen the superheated jet of plasma just goes right through
12:48 AM - Tailgate: i dont, fill me in
12:48 AM - Comr4de: ERA is used to counter that
12:48 AM - Tailgate: whats reactive armor
12:48 AM - Comr4de: ERA is made up of blocks of explosives
12:48 AM - RMS Gigantic: It's where they pack explosives around the vehicle
12:48 AM - Harm: my grandfather was a gunner on the USS Missouri
12:48 AM - Comr4de: yeah
12:48 AM - Harm: he would know the power of those guns
12:48 AM - RMS Gigantic: So then when a shell hits it
12:48 AM - RMS Gigantic: It explodes
12:48 AM - Comr4de: when triggered, the detonation would reverse the plasma jet
12:48 AM - RMS Gigantic: And, if I'm not mistaken, the explosion slows down the shell
12:48 AM - Comr4de: cancelling it out
12:48 AM - Comr4de: no
12:48 AM - RMS Gigantic: Ah
12:48 AM - Harm: *sprays molten metal into the hull
12:49 AM - RMS Gigantic: Sorry, I think in terms of ballistics and collisions
12:49 AM - Comr4de: yea
12:49 AM - Comr4de: well KE rounds don't work so well against ships period
12:49 AM - RMS Gigantic: Because, like they say on TVTropes
12:49 AM - RMS Gigantic: Ramming always works
12:49 AM - Comr4de: the reason they're so damn killy with tanks is because tanks are pressurized
12:49 AM - Comr4de: the sudden overpressure/depressurization of the tank literally crushes the crew
12:50 AM - Comr4de: if you look hard there are pics on the internet of iraqi tank crews half sucked out of a small hole in the 

side of the tank
12:50 AM - Comr4de: large ships aren't pressurized so it's not as effective
12:50 AM - Comr4de: the main naval threat today is aircraft
12:50 AM - Comr4de: you mentioned the yamato earlier
12:51 AM - Comr4de: while it put up a hell of a defense it was ultimately sunk by a bomber attack
12:51 AM - Harm: PGMs, PGMS everywhere
12:51 AM - Comr4de: i mean, the prince of wales got it's ass kicked too by jap torpedo bombers
12:51 AM - RMS Gigantic: I am probably wrong here, but the way I pictured naval combat was that they made weaponry that 

could punch through practically infinitely thick armor, so they made defensive that could ward off those weapons and thinned up 

their armor for maneuverability, so they made weapons that focused more on overcoming those defense measures than actually 

penetrating thick armor
12:51 AM - Comr4de: no, naval warfare has always been manuever based
12:51 AM - RMS Gigantic: *made defenses
12:51 AM - Tailgate: kamikazes sank ships too, and missiles are just like those but with no people flying them
12:51 AM - Comr4de: like glass sledgehammers
12:51 AM - Tailgate: and more sophisticated
12:52 AM - Comr4de: missiles have better range and hit more accurately than shells anyways
12:52 AM - RMS Gigantic: Only destroyers were glass sledgehammers
12:52 AM - Tailgate: so pretty much missiles are 100% better than kamikazes except you dont have to sacrafice a jap every 

time you use them
12:52 AM - Comr4de: the weakspot on a battleship becomes infinitely larger when some chucklefuck from idaho who wants to 

into boats can land an explosive warhead anywhere he wants on your ship
12:52 AM - RMS Gigantic: Battleships were like sledgehammer heads that could fling broken glass
12:53 AM - Comr4de: i would say battleships were like big burly men with sledgehammers
12:53 AM - RMS Gigantic: Also, didn't Kamikazes mostly damage aircraft carriers?
12:53 AM - Comr4de: obviously you're not going to beat him with your fists
12:53 AM - Comr4de: so what do you do?
12:53 AM - Comr4de: you run five miles away and SHOOT the fucker
12:53 AM - RMS Gigantic: Try telling that to the captain of a World War II destroyer
12:54 AM - Comr4de: I would but it would be easier to just send a missile to do that for me
12:54 AM - RMS Gigantic: His policy was to run right up to the guy, dodge the sledgehammer, and torch 'em
12:54 AM - Tailgate: except for those times where he doesnt dodge it and implodes on the spot
12:54 AM - Comr4de: unless the rear admiral in charge saw what was happening and called in air support
12:54 AM - RMS Gigantic: Exactly
12:54 AM - Comr4de: OR if there was a sub captain with half a brain
12:55 AM - Comr4de: battleships were big and slow
12:55 AM - Comr4de: and war became all about moving fast
12:55 AM - Comr4de: i mean, if you look at the evolution of warfare even tanks are becoming obsolete
12:55 AM - RMS Gigantic: Try telling that to the captain of U-103, who got his submarine ass done in by a ship that didn't land 

a hit on him via its guns
12:56 AM - RMS Gigantic: Hell, he got his sub ass done in by the sistership of the fucking Titanic
12:56 AM - Comr4de: "The crew was unable to flood the two stern torpedo tubes, and the submarine was sighted on the 

surface by Olympic, whose gunners opened fire as Olympic turned to ram."
12:56 AM - Comr4de: sounds like incompetence to me
12:56 AM - Comr4de: also: why did he surface
12:56 AM - Comr4de: incompetence
12:56 AM - RMS Gigantic: Those gunners on Olympic never hit their mark, though
12:56 AM - RMS Gigantic: He surfaced to torpedo the ship
12:56 AM - Comr4de: WHY DID HE SURFACE THOUGH
12:56 AM - Comr4de: wut
12:56 AM - RMS Gigantic: Otherwise the torpedoes would go right under
12:56 AM - Comr4de: wut.
12:57 AM - RMS Gigantic: Hmm, I suppose I am thinking to level
12:57 AM - Comr4de: so if hte olympic was fully loaded down
12:57 AM - Comr4de: she'd be riding pretty low in the water right
12:57 AM - RMS Gigantic: Can a submarine shoot torpedoes during WWI with an upward incline?
12:57 AM - Comr4de: yes
12:57 AM - RMS Gigantic: Ah, okay
12:57 AM - RMS Gigantic: Then I guess he did it to get a visual on the thing, being that it was the middle of the night
12:58 AM - RMS Gigantic: Because he was on a mission to sink her
12:58 AM - RMS Gigantic: And when he tried to dive
12:58 AM - RMS Gigantic: He ended up juuuuust deep enough where the Olympic cut his submarine open
12:58 AM - RMS Gigantic: with her screws (propellers)
12:58 AM - Comr4de: yes
12:59 AM - RMS Gigantic: Even though he dove deep enough to clear her hull
12:59 AM - RMS Gigantic: Even though it sidetracked us by a long way, I still find that to be a funny story
12:59 AM - Comr4de: citing one isolated incident is not evidence however, it's texas sharpshooting
12:59 AM - RMS Gigantic: The only instance in World War I where a warship was sunk by a merchant ship
1:00 AM - RMS Gigantic: Still, subs are REALLY under-protected
1:00 AM - RMS Gigantic: At least they were during the World Wars
1:00 AM - Comr4de: i don't even know why we're comparing 100 year old tech to state of the ary
1:00 AM - Comr4de: art
1:00 AM - Comr4de: there was a reason the world navies moved towards carrier-based tactics
1:00 AM - RMS Gigantic: Well, the argument started with whether an anti-ship missile could get through a battleship
1:00 AM - Comr4de: however
1:00 AM - Comr4de: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_cruiser_Moskva
1:00 AM - Comr4de: this is the closest thing to a battleship
1:00 AM - Comr4de: that's ever floated
1:01 AM - Comr4de: the answer is obviously yes it can
1:01 AM - Tailgate: my favorite part was when the russians launched an amphibious attack on a tourist beach
1:01 AM - Comr4de: otherwise they wouldnt be retired and anti-ship missiles wouldn't be so prevalent
1:01 AM - Comr4de: they're cool as shit to look at tho I'll give you that
1:01 AM - Comr4de: alright harm
1:01 AM - Comr4de: it is time to remove kebabs
1:01 AM - Harm: hi
1:01 AM - Harm: PT-76, amphibious tank
1:02 AM - Harm: Removes beach tourists
1:02 AM - Comr4de: no harm
1:02 AM - Comr4de: it was zubr