01:32 CXu: also idk, the map isnt bad, just old 01:32 sailentx: really man? 01:32 CXu: like this 01:32 sailentx: it is bad :P 01:33 sailentx: thats exactly the example how not to make a map 01:33 sailentx: the murloc map is the most trolliest map i've seen lmao 01:33 sailentx: actually that orchestra map with 1/4 spinners also beh 01:35 CXu: kokoro no chizu? 01:36 sailentx: it amazes me how you can play all that stuff 01:37 CXu: well, small circles are cool 01:38 CXu: also, most of the time old maps are "bad" just because they're old and don't follow the same mapping logic as stuff today 01:38 CXu: since I began in 2009, I've kinda been playing these kinds of maps since the beginning 01:38 CXu: so I dont find them bad :p 01:39 sailentx: yeah 01:39 sailentx: i think you lost feeling for it 01:39 CXu: oh wait orchestra 01:39 sailentx: you're saying that bad map is actually good :p 01:39 CXu: no 01:39 sailentx: but in fact only top players could play them 01:39 CXu: I'm saying they're not bad lol 01:40 sailentx: but just because you have such skill that it doesnt even matter that the map is bad 01:40 CXu: dude 01:40 CXu: drop it 01:40 CXu: you can dislike old mapping style all you want 01:40 sailentx: seriously man 01:40 CXu: but they're not bad 01:40 sailentx: if you say that murloc map is good 01:40 sailentx: thats bs 01:40 CXu: yes it is 01:40 sailentx: ask any other bat 01:40 CXu: tell me one reason it's bad 01:41 sailentx: they'll disagree 01:41 sailentx: i could tell a lot of reasons 01:41 CXu: sure 01:41 CXu: fire away 01:41 sailentx: bad distance snapping, slow ar, slider speeds are rediculous 01:42 sailentx: you can play that 01:42 sailentx: just cause you're good 01:42 CXu: distance snap is better than 90% of 2013 maps 01:42 CXu: 99% of 2013 maps have ar9 so new players have no clue how to play lower ar (try anyone who've been here for a while and they'll all be able to read that ar) 01:43 CXu: slider speed is less ridiculous than a lot of newer maps 01:43 sailentx: oh well 01:43 sailentx: but only top 25 01:43 sailentx: have fc on that map 01:43 sailentx: do you think thats normal? 01:43 sailentx: i think it tells a lot about the map 01:43 CXu: no 01:43 CXu: yes 01:43 CXu: it's old 01:43 CXu: people generally dont like old maps 01:43 CXu: they dont play old maps 01:43 CXu: doesn't mean it's bad 01:45 CXu: oh also 01:45 *CXu is listening to [http://osu.ppy.sh/b/32570 Blind Stare - Shotgun Symphony+] 01:45 CXu: is better than freedom dive 01:45 sailentx: hmm 01:45 sailentx: well 01:45 sailentx: if someone would try to make those kind of maps today ranked 01:45 sailentx: they wouldnt even get close to being ranked 01:45 sailentx: and im not a bat 01:46 sailentx: you should know better 01:46 CXu: ranking criteria change 01:46 CXu: burai sliders are fun, but they're unrankable now 01:46 CXu: hold sliders are unrankable, though they're also fun to play 01:46 sailentx: but pretty sure someone could tell you many reasons why those maps arent rankable 01:46 CXu: yeah sure 01:46 sailentx: and no its not because of their old style 01:46 CXu: also 01:47 CXu: implying ranked = high quality bestmap4ever 01:47 CXu: but yes, many of the old maps probably wouldnt be ranked as-is today 01:47 CXu: and so what? 01:47 sailentx: dunno nothing, it just confuses me 01:47 CXu: there are a bunch of unranked maps that are better than ranked ones 01:47 sailentx: that you say they're good 01:47 CXu: yes they are 01:48 sailentx: while you can clearly see, that theres not much effort put in them 01:48 sailentx: they're just troll maps 01:48 CXu: ... 01:48 sailentx: idk who even ranked that 01:48 CXu: "not much effort" 01:48 CXu: are you kidding me lol 01:48 sailentx: lol 01:48 sailentx: anyway 01:48 CXu: most ranked maps today took 1/10th of the effort 01:48 sailentx: because like, if i made a map like that today 01:48 sailentx: you'd like it? 01:48 sailentx: thats what confuses me 01:48 CXu: of old maps probalby 01:48 CXu: yes I would if it makes sense 01:49 sailentx: i mean you should be example of what is good and what not so people dont repeat bad stuff :P 01:49 CXu: actually 01:49 CXu: even if it didnt I probably would 01:49 *CXu is listening to [http://osu.ppy.sh/b/330469 kemu - Six Trillion Years and Overnight Story] 01:49 CXu: it's like this 01:49 CXu: I like millhiore's diff 01:49 CXu: I also like CS6, so I mapped with CS6 01:49 *CXu is listening to [http://osu.ppy.sh/b/211154 MomoKuro-tei Ichimon - Nippon Egao Hyakkei (TV Size)] 01:50 CXu: it's not like everything needs to be AR9 OD7 constant 1/2 occasional streams random distance snapping random jumps 01:50 CXu: as most maps today are 01:50 CXu: not saying they're bad, because they are decent maps 01:50 sailentx: well i do like older maps i'll admit it, im also playing some of them, i just hate when they dont make sense to me or they're retarded hard or undoable 01:50 CXu: they just lack individuality as old maps do 01:50 CXu: then get better 01:51 CXu: freedom dive is hard because of streams 01:51 CXu: idk if you hate that map but I'm just gonna assume you dont hate it as much as old maps at least 01:51 CXu: older maps just test other aspects of your skill 01:51 CXu: aspects that dont turn up often anymore in recent maps 01:51 sailentx: nope i dont like it that much 01:52 CXu: basically, hating something because "Ican'tplayit" is dumb 01:52 sailentx: yeah but i didnt say that 01:52 sailentx: actually most of people cant play it 01:52 sailentx: even ranks ~1k 01:52 CXu: http://puu.sh/6Kilt.jpg 01:52 sailentx: they fail miserably you should see 01:52 CXu: basically, you cant play it 01:52 sailentx: you're one of the rare persons that can play old stuff 01:52 CXu: then most of people suck 01:53 CXu: and dont deserve their rank 01:53 CXu: ok 01:53 sailentx: Lol 01:53 CXu: people FCd murloc in 2010/2011 01:54 sailentx: yup but 01:54 sailentx: lets say you uses higher ar on that 01:54 CXu: if people today can't do it, then that's not the map being hard, that's them beign bad 01:54 sailentx: wouldnt it be easier? 01:54 CXu: it would 01:54 sailentx: i think everyone could agree. 01:54 CXu: higher ar makes it easier to snap 01:54 CXu: millhiore would disagree tho 01:54 CXu: he'd say it's probably the same with AR0 as AR8 01:55 CXu: low AR reading is just something most people dont do anymore because you dont need it for newer maps 01:55 sailentx: what do you mean harder to snap, even if he calls that perfectly snapped i cant hit it naturally 01:55 sailentx: i need to concentrate on approaching circles so much 01:55 sailentx: and i've seen you miss too 01:55 CXu: snapping means your cursor movement 01:55 sailentx: dont say anything :P 01:55 CXu: I'm worse at low ar than higher ar, yes 01:55 CXu: so what, lol 01:55 CXu: still doesnt mean the map is bad 01:56 CXu: if anything, players just suck 01:56 sailentx: yeah wel basically 01:56 sailentx: if #200 global rank player 01:56 sailentx: cant play that naturally 01:56 sailentx: the map sucks 01:56 sailentx: thats how i see it, especially 01:56 CXu: hahahahano 01:56 sailentx: <1k rank 01:56 CXu: I miss on remote control 01:56 CXu: is that a bad map? 01:56 CXu: no 01:56 CXu: I miss on a random easy map 01:56 CXu: is that a bad map? 01:56 CXu: nop 01:56 CXu: what are you talking about 01:57 sailentx: we all do, thats different lol 01:57 CXu: I've already FCd murloc btw 01:57 CXu: just fyi 01:57 sailentx: sec 01:58 sailentx: aw, i see, ~96% acc hm aye 01:58 CXu: indeed 01:58 sailentx: well i dont wanna argue 01:58 CXu: guess hwo long I had played 01:58 CXu: 2 years 01:58 CXu: are you telling me 01:58 CXu: that people today, who've played for 2 years 01:58 CXu: who can't play this 01:59 CXu: are not "bad", but that I was exceptionally good then? 01:59 CXu: probably not 01:59 sailentx: they might be perfectly timed and all, but still they're harder than if they'd be idk higher ar + bigger cs right,? and that would make lets say murloc map better 01:59 CXu: no 01:59 CXu: easier =/= better 02:00 CXu: also 02:00 sailentx: no but not easier 02:00 sailentx: yeah that map would be ez pz 02:00 sailentx: if that was used 02:00 sailentx: but in fact now its hard thats true 02:00 CXu: yes 02:00 CXu: it's true it's hard 02:00 CXu: I never said it wasn't 02:00 CXu: but I'm not even arguing about that 02:00 CXu: I'm arguing it's not a bad map 02:01 CXu: you're the one even talking about hard/easy maps and how many people can play it 02:01 CXu: to gauge if it's a good map or not 02:02 sailentx: ah 02:02 sailentx: its just not fun to play at all, or is it? 02:02 CXu: it is 02:02 CXu: I 02:02 CXu: 'll pick these maps 02:02 CXu: over most of the ranked maps today 02:03 CXu: any day 02:03 sailentx: maybe cause im so bad idk, but i've talked with other players that are even better than me, they said its just a bad map 02:03 sailentx: some of them even bats :P 02:03 CXu: then that's them 02:03 CXu: they can disagree 02:03 CXu: so can you 02:03 sailentx: timing is good 02:03 CXu: but you're trying to convince me they're bad maps 02:03 sailentx: notes are fine sure 02:03 CXu: and I wont be convinced 02:03 sailentx: if you play auto thats perfectly fine 02:03 sailentx: but anyone can do that 02:03 CXu: and I'm not convinced from what you're saying either 02:04 sailentx: the thing is to make the map naturally easier for players to play 02:04 sailentx: and to make it harder in another aspects 02:04 CXu: >one way to map 02:04 CXu: >several other ways to map exists 02:04 CXu: keep going, I'm listening 02:04 CXu: I don't agree though 02:05 sailentx: awh 02:05 CXu: murloc >http://osu.ppy.sh/s/141964 02:05 CXu: just to pick a random map